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Posted: 4/21/2009 10:33 PM
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pirate_sephiroth
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New systems TAS of 2009
After some study, I got this: The Revenge Tech is pratically mastered now (all that is left is to test the Stopwatch's influence), so the battle with Slogra and Gaibon is even faster now; we won't need the Spirit in the battle with Karasuman, since the potion provides enough invincibility for the tech; we should use the axe to replace the Bwaka Knife (might be even easier to perform the big toss with it); Great expectations, huh? Update in the RAM Watch file: Revenge Tech Timer added (boss only) 
!973F0 ·X|position·
!973F4 ·Y|position·
733E2 ·X|speed·
733E6 ·Y|speed·
72F1C Invulnerability
72EFC Disabled|control
!76ED6 ·Boss||HP·
!77282 ·Dracula|2|HP·
!774B6 ·Gaibon|HP·
97C30 ·Hours·
97C34 ·Minutes·
97C38 ·Seconds·
!97BB0 ·CUR.|MP·
!97BB4 ·MAX|MP·
!97BB8 ·STR·
!97BBC ·CON·
!97BC0 ·INT·
!97BC4 ·LCK·
!97BEC ·EXPERIENCE·
136422 ·Loading|U/D·
136424 ·Loading|L/R·
76EF0 Revenge|Timer
X09010 RNG|Low|word
X09012 RNG|High|word
"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself. It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success." - Onkar Ghate
Bisqwit wrote:
Drama, too long, didn't read, lol.
Posted: 4/21/2009 10:41 PM
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arukAdo
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I doubt whe can replace bwaka by axe, probably wont go enought fast, but that worth a try at least, good idea :p you actually tryed it already maybe? I made some tests, i did conclude whe need to make somes changes on the kill pattern, im just needing to test potion in flicker now to get sure
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Posted: 4/29/2009 6:38 PM
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pirate_sephiroth
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New systems TAS of 2009
Little update: Collision thing for the revenge tech: Different address for each instance. Normally 0, is set to 144 (0x90) 2 frames before the collision is shown. The stopwatch freezes this value during its effect, so it's really easy to do the glitch with it (as long as it affects the enemy). Anyway, more research is needed.
"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself. It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success." - Onkar Ghate
Bisqwit wrote:
Drama, too long, didn't read, lol.
Posted: 4/30/2009 2:52 PM
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arukAdo
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Just to tease a bit more: I made a run with clear game memcard, like the youtube link i posted earlier in the topic The run made by the human player hit last save room with 13:52, and my run do 11:23 The best human run with bat relic did 16:30 Its hardly comparable, alltought i think its worthy to mention That run i made gonna be on youtube, when the real run gets completed :p
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Posted: 5/12/2009 7:37 PM
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pirate_sephiroth
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New systems TAS of 2009
1HR shift line is really impossible. The minimal gap alucard needs to fall in is 7 pixels wide, and his faster move is the drop kick (5 pixels). The wingsmash won't work either (6 pixels only). Big toss can make it with a single Lvl up pause (8 pixels), and the backdash can make 7 pixels with two pauses if the first one happens in the very first frame (4 pixels, then 3) I was observing the glitch. It's like a desynchronization between Alucard's position and graphics... when there's a pause near the edges of the room, right in the transition point where the scrolling stops, Alucard's sprite moves faster than his X position (maybe duiring the pause the game thinks it's still in the scrolling zone). And the sprite's position has no value for warping because we can move past the boundaries and do our "Edge Travel". To check that for yourself, stand near the edge of a room, where the scrolling is not active... say, the left one and save a state. Look at your X position (address 973F0): suppose it's "20". Using the cheat function, change it to "27" and save another state. This should move Alucard 7 pixels to the right, away from the edge, but apparently nothing happens. Now disable the cheat (the old value (20) will be restored abd for some reason Alucard will warp to the transition point) and load the last savestate with the altered position. Compare both old and new savestates: same view, but different positions in memory. The "Shift Line" has been created.
"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself. It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success." - Onkar Ghate
Bisqwit wrote:
Drama, too long, didn't read, lol.
Posted: 5/12/2009 7:53 PM
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arukAdo
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The most curious about this technique, is the "stackable" effect of this As in, You determined the narrowest distance (something bug did already, long ago, and checked recently again because of 1HR theorys and my findings with SR or ideas with wingsmash ect...) But As you know, you can stack the effect, using several stop screen together will create "larger" shiftline I think the reason of all this is visually presented to us Simply, the layout of the screen is decaled equal to alucard movement, and effectivly, the sprites whe "see" after the technique are leaked Its nearly like the engine updated position/boundarys of the room, but not alucard one, or the opposite case at least This is from the stop screen effect, apparently it behave like also stoping the engine to update positions (or whatever its directly linked to) The most curious is when you use "long" ET (after 20HRs) or when you use massive shiftline technique, making alucard for exemple travel over 1 screen trough the "effect" All this doesnt explain why on saturn... 1HR ET can work trough the dive kick (dashing) and futhermore, not on all screens... only certain ones (witch include near the guardian) Bug alltought did noticed me several times, all rooms are not having the same behavior, for obscur reasons and no apparent or tangible leads, without having found something interresting about it, but, its probably linked on why it doesnt work on saturn for any ET'able rooms (with just 1HR) All your reflection is 100% correct tought, and your measures are also precise i think (well, bug would confirm that, im pretty sure) I wont say theres nothing more to uncover, theres is, bug is aware too, but whe dont have an answer on a 1HR ET so far
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Posted: 5/28/2009 12:02 AM
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pirate_sephiroth
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New systems TAS of 2009
A quick note: At keep, we are 262 EXP to the next level, but Fleariders are giving only 150 (Alucard @ Lv 5) we need to get at least those 112 EXP before them (or kill one of them, what does not seem possible, since we'll need to have all boys alive for the 4 tosses). I imagined 2 options: *1 - Medusa Heads give 38, and I'm almost sure we can kill that one in Outer Wall plus 3 in Clock Tower (at Lv 4, before Cloaked Knight) for 114 EXP. *2 - Flea Armors give 120, and we can kill one as we're returning from the Knight. <--- I'm 100% sure of that, it's the best option, I'm picking this one.
"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself. It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success." - Onkar Ghate
Bisqwit wrote:
Drama, too long, didn't read, lol.
Posted: 5/28/2009 12:11 AM
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arukAdo
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Other option might be to kill an harpy on your way, witch could save some troubles for jumping on gears Trough axe it might also be possible to kill the fleaman that toss you after you get double jump, if timing allow it
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Posted: 5/28/2009 7:26 PM
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pirate_sephiroth
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New systems TAS of 2009
We can't kill Harpies after the Knight. And if we kill them before him, they give 200+ EXP... and that's a Lv UP.
"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself. It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success." - Onkar Ghate
Bisqwit wrote:
Drama, too long, didn't read, lol.
Posted: 5/28/2009 7:29 PM
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arukAdo
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Yeah, you would lvl up on harpy, then kill knight and should not get lvl up from him
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Posted: 5/28/2009 8:29 PM
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pirate_sephiroth
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arukAdo wrote:
Trough axe it might also be possible to kill the fleaman that toss you after you get double jump, if timing allow it
Hmm... I don't believe that... the axe can't kill a Medusa Head, let alone a Flea Rider.
"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself. It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success." - Onkar Ghate
Bisqwit wrote:
Drama, too long, didn't read, lol.
Posted: 5/30/2009 7:30 AM
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arukAdo
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That was unexcepted but your probably right, your not enought powerfull for killing it just with 1 axe, would require something else, they have 16HP
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Posted: 6/4/2009 6:19 PM
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pirate_sephiroth
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New systems TAS of 2009
Tonight I'll try that Medusa Shield stuff one more time... but just because you believe it can work without the attack potion. Honestly, I don't. EDIT: it's useless, as I thought. Even if we can kill Dracula, we still have to dodge his attacks. If we die and the Fairy uses a Life Apple, then when we return the medusa lasers are gone. We can't stay alive for long either... at Lv21 with Alucard gear we still die in 3 blows. Maybe that would be possible, but in the Bat run: we could end the movie flying.
"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself. It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success." - Onkar Ghate
Bisqwit wrote:
Drama, too long, didn't read, lol.
Posted: 6/4/2009 6:32 PM
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arukAdo
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I was thinking the fairy will heal you rather than revive you, using a potion On my test it worked, i guess because i had a higher DEF (more hits > fairy heal you), did you tryed with shield potion (+10DEF) ?
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Posted: 6/6/2009 12:11 AM
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pirate_sephiroth
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OK, Shield Potion adds +15 DEF... and we stay in the left side of the screen so his hands cannot hit Alucard. Yeah, we can survive. BUT, in order to kill Dracula, we need: 1- At least 14 STR; (seems rather high to me) 2- All 4 Medusa Lasers on screen 3- Shield Potion. If we use it down there, for the Guardians, are you sure that it will remain active after the elevator, the slow rising through the shaft and 2 cutscenes before the bosses? Also remember that to cast cast the 2nd Medusa Shield spell we need to wait for the Medusa Head to disappear, and that happens 63 frames after you regain control. AND we need the 4 lasers, what oughtta cost more frames. It might make the ending more interesting, but I'm not really sure it'll be faster.
"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself. It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success." - Onkar Ghate
Bisqwit wrote:
Drama, too long, didn't read, lol.
Posted: 6/6/2009 12:14 AM
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arukAdo
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I never claimed it was faster, for sure, i realy doubt about this been faster I was thinking, *maybe* this can be faster And yeah i confirm, you would use the potion after dialogue with dracula, not vs guardian (require 2 menu access...) Now yeah for entertainement, its more fun i think, if its slower i think whe should not use it tought Edit: ah, btw, i told you its possible to survive! lol :p
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Posted: 6/8/2009 7:19 PM
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pirate_sephiroth
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zggzdydp had this same idea last year, but he imagined it would be faster (we could end the movie earlier, just after we cast the 2nd medusa spell.) More Medusa bullshit reflections: Alucard Shield needs to be cast only once (Before Shaft) and finishes Dracula in 4 seconds (a little more than that actually, because we must wait for him to come down a bit), but we have to keep playing until the very end. With Medusa, we'll can end the input earlier, but all the additional actions take a considerable amount of time: menu, switch hand equipment from Alucard Shield to Shield Potion > around 1 second use Shield Potion > few frames menu, equip Medusa Shield > around 1 second Cast Medusa Shield magic and wait for the earlier opportunity to cast it again> 2 seconds and a half IF WE'RE LUCKY. Yeah, it's LIKELY to be slower. If we could use the first Medusa magic while Dracula is pretty high and get the second magic very soon then it would perhaps be just as fast as Alucard Shield.
"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself. It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success." - Onkar Ghate
Bisqwit wrote:
Drama, too long, didn't read, lol.
Posted: 6/8/2009 8:32 PM
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arukAdo
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If it work anyway, its going to be much more funny to watch, i vote medusa shield if possible to pick it up, and that whe have enought str to beat dracula with it :p If fail to beat dracula, whe dont loose time on getting the medusa shield anyway, so it realy doesnt matter after all if whe cant make a epic ending
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Posted: 6/9/2009 7:41 PM
(Edited: 6/9/2009 7:48 PM)
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pirate_sephiroth
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Tonigh I'll try to simulate it anyway. If I can get 14 STR at the final save point, the medusa shield is in the scheme. EDIT: STR 14, although not very easy, is actually achievable. By the way, we'll reach Dracula at Lv 23. EDIT 2: Ah yeah, since I was there, I did this quick map illustrating my planned route.
"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself. It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success." - Onkar Ghate
Bisqwit wrote:
Drama, too long, didn't read, lol.
Posted: 6/9/2009 7:48 PM
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arukAdo
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Whe are level 4 or 5 i think at fleamans So this mean whe get +18 level, at least Would need to get +13str within thoses, including medusa combo lvlups Edit: about your pic, yes that what i was thinking too myself, same idea :p
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Posted: 10/31/2009 5:58 PM
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arukAdo
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Something pretty amazing been found on that game recently If you watch this : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DUZgYB4If0E At some point near end, says "Richter Special Mode", then shows few awesome passage where richter get trough floors litteraly For years nobody knew how to "activate" this stuff, had a savestate but who knows how to trigger the memory bug... well now it seem to be uncover While in alucard game, turn into a mist or bat (and dont turn it off) then soft reset (L1/L2/R1/R2/Select/Start) and load a richter save, should be able to perform the tricks in the video, tought, i dont know yet if it work on usa release, was just tested on jap original release This may (or not...) enable nasty strategys for alucard or richter speedrun, and would require to have dirty sram in order to achieve it
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Posted: 11/2/2009 6:33 AM
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pirate_sephiroth
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New systems TAS of 2009
what? I thought you'd need to do all the infinity item glitch and then morph into bat so you become invisible, then you'd reset...
"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself. It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success." - Onkar Ghate
Bisqwit wrote:
Drama, too long, didn't read, lol.
Posted: 3/3/2010 1:08 AM
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Derakon
Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960
What would be a good set of rules for a "challenge" TAS of SotN? My personal take would be: * No items (including healing items, so no Potions for invincibility) * No equipment, excepting the Spikebreaker Armor, Gold/Silver Rings, and Holy Eyeglasses, which must each be removed as soon as possible. * All bosses * No glitches (e.g. Wolf Rise, out-of-bounds travel, etc.) Spells are still in because of Wolf Charge and Wing Snap -- if you ban spells, are they also banned? Banning most spells but not these seems arbitrary. Subweapons are still in because they aren't hugely more powerful than fists and would provide some nice variety to combat. Relics are still in because you absolutely require some for glitchless traversal of the castles and saying that some stay while others are forbidden, again, seems arbitrary. Besides, most of them are off-route enough to not be worth getting. Thoughts? I'm not about to start TASing this, but it occurred to me that SotN doesn't have a "100%" TAS yet, and I was wondering how such a TAS could be made interesting while being as distinct as possible from the any% TAS.
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
Posted: 6/7/2010 8:52 PM
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Antoids
Joined: 8/27/2009
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIQC8CKQKn8#t=18m40s I just watched this video, and I'm really curious as to what's going on in the last boss fight. It looks like some insane luck manipulation at a guess, but I'd like to know more if someone's willing to explain.
Posted: 6/7/2010 9:36 PM
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Derakon
Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960
The basic concept is to use the Shield Rod + the Medusa Shield to cast a powerful attack spell. This spell is almost strong enough to kill Dracula (which means that input can end shortly after it is cast, with some extra attacks from Alucard), but it takes a long time to do so. In order to survive Drac's attacks in the meantime, a Defense Potion is used -- remember that Alucard also still has all his old gear, so his defense is pretty respectable even with his low level. There might be some manipulation to control which attacks Dracula uses, but he's not a particularly aggressive boss, as I recall. The main thing is to kill him before he decides to do his background attack, which he's flying off to do right before he dies. Does that answer your question?
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
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