First of all, I wanted to share this awesomeness with all of you:
Super Mario Bros. 3 Nintendo Power Strategy Guide and Sample page
(If it doesn't load, try again later, stupid geocities..)
I found this at my parents' house in the attic with a bunch of old gaming magazines. I got this back in October of 1990!
Alright, I searched for SMB3 threads and really couldn't find a good one to post on, so I'm making my own for this run. I won't be using whistles, but otherwise I'm going for fastest time. This means I won't be playing every level, unnecessary hammer brothers, or anything else that isn't absolutely necessary to get me to the end of the game as fast as possible.
So first, I'm going to be figuring out my path before I start running the game. I won't be able to determine absolutely everything because of randomness of the hammer brothers moving. But things that I need to consider:
Which levels to take when paths branch. Usually this is a pretty obvious choice, but some decisions are close and need to be tested.
Which levels to skip with clouds. There are five clouds in the game, one of them hidden in 3-7 (which may not be worth getting), and the others from hammer brothers or princess letters.
When to use musicboxes to avoid hammer brothers (or maybe stop them from moving). When to get hammers and use them to skip levels. Figuring out how much I can manipulate the hammer bros. movement on the map.
Testing which levels can be severely skipped or shortened with a P-wing (World 7 comes to mind). Walljumping may work in some cases as well.
I also wonder if there is a reason others have used PRG1 when running this game. I would prefer PRG0 because the names of the worlds in the ending are cooler, but that's my only reason really. If anyone knows of some strange problem with using PRG0 then please let me know.
Once I have a basic route down, I'll post it here and then I guess I'll work on learning this game's engine.
<Swordless> Go hug a tree, you vegetarian (I bet you really are one)
Guybrush: "I'm selling these fine leather jackets."
Wally: "Really?"
Guybrush: "No. I 'm lying."
Wally: "In that case, I don't want one!"
Currently working on:
Nothing at the moment.
Awesome, indeed.
Luckily they are still in abundance: Guide
But always a cool item to have :).
Looking forward to your run JXQ. You always post quality stuff!
Oh man, I would be such an ass if I didn't share some of these glorious quotes from this guide:
SUPER MARIO BROS. 3 NINTENDO POWER STRATEGY GUIDE wrote:
"You have to like the Tanooki Suit. Not only is it cool looking, it gives Mario the power to turn into a Statue."
"You have to act fast on these Donut Lifts. Stomp Dry Bones, collect the item and hit the road! Try not to panic!"
"B Button run and jump over this one. It's easy if you know he's there; that's the beauty of video maps!"
"Go straight down at the beginning of the world to find a Power-Up. You should always collect Power-Ups, because they're worth 1,000 points."
Seriously, I was expecting to turn the page and read EASTMOST PENINSULA IS THE SECRET! But in all fairness, this book has maps of every level, and that lets me think about optimizing while at work. So here's some stuff I've come up with:
There are five Jugem's Cloud items. Two are in Princess's letters, two are from Hammer Bros, and one is from a secret in World 3-7. I determined that it's not worth it to get that fifth cloud from 3-7. Instead I will be using a cloud to bypass 3-6 (an autoscrolling level) when the bridges are intact to go directly to 3-8. Getting the cloud in 3-7 would require beating 3-6 and 3-7, both with autoscrolling parts. As of now, the levels that will be skipped will be 3-6, 5-9, and 7-4 (all autoscrollers), and an undetermined fourth level, which must be in World 6, 7, or 8. I'm unsure at this point which level would benefit the time the most by skipping it.
There are three P-Wings that are gotten automatically when finishing worlds 1, 4 and 6. (There are also more to get from various hammer brothers, but I don't think they benefit enough) Two levels that would benefit from a P-wing are 7-1 and 7-6 - both of the indoor pipe levels where you jump and ride on the light-bulb lifts. Since I'll have a third for free, I'm not sure which level would be best. Perhaps more than one level would offset the time it took to get one from a hammer brother. 3-1 and 4-4 come to mind as levels that would gain a slight amount of time with a P-wing (both levels are mostly water). One other thing to consider when using a P-wing is how soon and without delay Mario can regain firepower (or at least, stop being raccoon).
There is one music box obtained at the end of world 3, and another hidden in a fast exit of 5-1. I'll definitely use one in World 7 to bypass the second plant-level, and the other near the end of World 6 to minimize hammer brother movement (they walk all day in that stupid world).
There is one place to use a hammer - bypassing world 6-7 - and there are three places to get a hammer. I think getting one from a hammer brother in World 3 is the best bet because it puts an extra level between the beginning and skipping 3-6, ensuring that the bridge will be down.
Lastly, there will be one star in the inventory from the unavoidable hammer brother in World 1. Any ideas where it might be useful? Maybe a short mini-fortress where I could kill Boom-Boom immediately with it. (I also may have a whistle from the first mini-fortress in inventory, depending on if it's faster to finish the level that way, or to wall-glitch to boom-boom and fireball him. Not that it matters much cuz it won't be used.)
So...if anyone has ideas on where to use clouds, P-wings, etc. or general map suggestions or questions, let me know, and I'll add it to my list of stuff to test.
Other stuff I wrote down to test:
1) Are treasure ships faster than hammer bros in respect to map movement?
2) How many turns does a music box last?
3) Does less hammer brothers remaining = less overall movement time on map screen?
I'll keep updating with what I find out in an effort to answer as many questions as I can. This way, by the time this is all done, everyone can be confident that the route is optimal. Thanks to everyone for the support!
Edit: DK64 could you possibly shorten your post to avoid side-scrolling?
Edit-squared: I also decided to use PRG1 as everyone else has, because it will make comparisons easier. (Specifically, I'm interested to see how much time difference there will be between Vatchern's run and mine.)
<Swordless> Go hug a tree, you vegetarian (I bet you really are one)
Holy crap. I remember that I had a strategy guide of this game, although I doubt that it was the Nintendo Power one. That was the only way that I could beat the card game.
I can't answer your first question, and although I believe that the hammer brothers movements are random, again I can't say for sure. A music box lasts two turns; activating it is the first, and the stage that you play after that is the second.
Have fun.
Joined: 5/1/2004
Posts: 4096
Location: Rio, Brazil
all hammer bros move at the same time, so if you manipulate it right (by exiting the level 1 frame later or sooner) you can get all of them to move only 1 square, all at the same time.
i don't know if treasure ships move, do they?
and what about the toad's houses? arent you going in any of them?
The only one I can think of that will save time would be to get the hammer suit in World 6, if it's fast enough against bowser to justify that time and then some. Can you think of others that may help?
FODA wrote:
all hammer bros move at the same time, so if you manipulate it right (by exiting the level 1 frame later or sooner) you can get all of them to move only 1 square, all at the same time.
Really? Even in the later worlds when they just walk and walk and walk and walk? That would be great. And I just tested, treasure ships do move at the same speed as hammer brothers, just without the shuffling sound. It may be neat to get one sometime in the run, as long as I can avoid it (and it's not a good prize I'd be missing).
Edit: I'm trying to do the duck-jump into a corner trick on a few levels and I just can't get it to work. I was wondering if someone who already can do the trick well could verify if it's possible to use in 7-1, to duck jump into the space with the door and push through the wall entirely to skip the level. Something similar may be possible in 6-5, although there is a middle room to deal with.
Edit #4096: I have mapped out the route's progress so far, it can be found here. Or in my signature for the time being.
<Swordless> Go hug a tree, you vegetarian (I bet you really are one)
Joined: 12/7/2005
Posts: 11
Location: Quebec (Germany for now)
JXQ wrote:
daniayaw wrote:
and what about the toad's houses? arent you going in any of them?
The only one I can think of that will save time would be to get the hammer suit in World 6, if it's fast enough against bowser to justify that time and then some. Can you think of others that may help?
Last time i played i killed Bowser with the Hamer Bros. suit, took just a couple of hits, it does kill him pretty fast, but just to make sure you should still test it. =P
Edit: I'm trying to do the duck-jump into a corner trick on a few levels and I just can't get it to work. I was wondering if someone who already can do the trick well could verify if it's possible to use in 7-1, to duck jump into the space with the door and push through the wall entirely to skip the level.
Yes, it's definitely possible there. Here's a movie of it: http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/459/
It's for the SNES version but since I didn't use left+right that makes no difference (the input can be converted back and forth directly except where there are lag frames, which don't affect the gameplay anyway, at least not in this short of a timeframe).
Note: In that movie, I backed up to get slightly more of a running start, but I don't think it was really necessary.
I think it would be cool if we kept at par with each other level for level so we could help each other if needed. but that means you would probably have to wait for me since i do more levels ^_^
Woot! This changes everything. You don't even have to be at full speed to use that glitch? Oh my. I also wonder if there are places that allow you to use the glitch that Genisto shows off in his Amazing run, for example in the well-known Toad House death, to skip through a level like that. I'll work more on the route tomorrow with this new info. Thanks!
Vatchern wrote:
I think it would be cool if we kept at par with each other level for level so we could help each other if needed. but that means you would probably have to wait for me since i do more levels ^_^
I think this sounds like a good idea too. I would just need to find something to do while waiting (equals another run), otherwise I'd probably get restless and race ahead, as I sometimes (always) tend to do with this hobby.
<Swordless> Go hug a tree, you vegetarian (I bet you really are one)
