Joined: 3/18/2006
Posts: 971
Location: Great Britain
it seems map zoning only works on the pc version
it was briefly tested in 2009
the issue is that only certain types of sequences can be skipped by entering the menu: random encounters in fields and midgar zolom scene (so far)
Okay regarding the limit breaks. There were several types of bugs in early builds of the game in each region. I know some of them are not just hearsay as I had the first release of PAL FFVII and USA FFVII. The following ones can definitely happen:
*You can skip 1-2, 2-1, 2-2 limit breaks if a character is not used for a long period of time then made fairly active in battles later on in the game. While you benefit from powerful level 3 limits without much work, you lose the chance to equip a 4th level limit break.
*You can learn all your limits naturally but the 4th limit cannot be learned (useless bug and a real bitch in normal circumstances)!
Ideally you'd want to trigger bug #1 (Ungermax, Meteorain, Tifa's combos etc.). This bug is real but trying to figure out what sets it off is well....beyond me.
Shame the Zone Mapping won't come in too handy, either.
Joined: 3/18/2006
Posts: 971
Location: Great Britain
so there is a glitch where starting a new game has cloud with his limit level 3?
do you remember if you used soft-reset at anytime (start+select+shoulder buttons) before these glitches happened?
there might be some evidence that soft-reset has a role in this
now you mention it, this happened when i was trying to see how quick i could exit midgar on the console, kept soft resetting and eventually kept playing through the game with my save.
starting with 1-1 - 4-1 is pure rumour at the moment. what im on about is i earned 1-2, but then for some reason 2-1, 2-2 did not trigger and by disc 2/3 the character earned 3-1, 3-2 after a few battles.
when you go to the limit screen in the menu 2-1, 2-2 are clearly missing. this has happened with other characters where i never bothered using them until disc 2 when i had to, then they skipped 1-2, 2-1, 2-2.
hope that makes sense.
critical against bosses becomes naturally possible in the speed run anyway
So lack of luck is only problem for palmer, red dragon and a which other bosses?
and can someone answer me this:
And what points in the run and how long does it take to get the luck plus materia, and the amulet from mideel?
And what possibility is there for manipulating more bonus to luck upon level up? (is this even such a thing?) Or manipulating more EXP for faster leveling up?
"Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence."
Joined: 3/18/2006
Posts: 971
Location: Great Britain
brutalal informed me that limits can be skipped naturally
it seems 2-2 cannot be skipped within the game's mechanics though
how good is your memory? :p
Spider-Waffle wrote:
.
idk, brutalal is creating a luck calculator.
TotA: luck plus takes <1s (a glitch is used to get it fast)
base luck is worthless until tifa's level is beyond the threshold (28+ or something)
double exp from bosses = at least twice the battle length
it has been used only once against Gi, as the boss is so quickly defeated.
There are a few problems using slots:
- time taken to kill 40 enemies with cait sith to unlock 2nd limit.
- time taken to build his limit up every time you want to use it, think multi-form bosses
- some people will find the run less interesting if used all the time
It's can't tell if it is faster or not.
I have been testing pause/menu skipping but haven't found anything yet.
Joined: 3/18/2006
Posts: 971
Location: Great Britain
40 enemies = < 10 minutes (can get groups)
15 minutes boss saving
3 minutes wasted gaining a full limit bar (assuming each boss is given 10 seconds to fill cait's limit)
there are other things that can be skipped too, which will ultimately save time
Even in this worst case approximation, it seems Slots is faster.
I cant decide if it is less entertaining to use it or not. This is because I don't know what's entertaining about Tifa's deathblow repeated in every battle.
I guess it would really depend on how good the strategy of killing 40 enemies is.
My belief is if you had cait-sith finish all bosses and compulsory enemies, and kill some groups of 5 Kyuvildens's (grass hopper things) in Nibelheim mountains, you could get it quite quick.
http://www.gamefaqs.com/ps/197341-final-fantasy-vii/faqs/16441
Note 2: There are some exceptions to what does and does not count toward your
kill total.
1) Kills made with Odin's Steel Cutting Sword attack do NOT count.
2) Kills made by residual poison damage, i.e. the damage taken each round, not
the damage caused by the initial casting, do NOT count.
3) Kills made by enemies you have manipulated do NOT count.
4) Kills made with Death Sentence do NOT count.
5) Kills made with the Death spell DO count.
6) Kills made with Flash command DO count.
Also of interest, miming your limit breaks DOES count toward the usage totals.
It's also worth mentioning that apparently nothing you do in battle arena, be
it kills or uses, will count toward your totals.
Joined: 5/30/2009
Posts: 135
Location: Top of the pops
I'm still interested to see what kind of strategies and manipulation a TAS can allow for. If you do use slots, you could just as well end the TAS after you get it and give the final time because everything after that point will be exactly the same.
I think the focus should be on other time saving tricks, and worry about abuse of one measly attack in a revised or improved version of the TAS. At least have something to work with before judging it makes sense to me. Could easily argue tifa's attack would be all the same, pause glitch would be all the same. Garlands normal run doesnt care about abusing methods in such way why should a TAS?
Antd. Forget what I said earlier. You should do whatever you think is the fastest. Use the pause glitch for manipulation and use Cait's slots. If it breaks the game so be it. There is a non assisted run for a reason.
Edit: And when this run is finished we will get started on the ff9 run! (Wishful thinking, I know)
Agree with other posters, just need a complete run, then we have something to work off in regards to improvements. Plus it will get more people posting.
Well you know where I stand in regards to speed. I find the ingenious, creative, deeply analyzed strategies used to find speed beautiful and entertaining in among themselves. Speed also holds an objective quality that must be appreciated and can never be denied by anyone.
Rough draft idea doesn't seem bad, but how long would it take? If it will take 10% of the time the final draft will take, I say go for it, but if it's more like 50%, then no.
Also, isn't it possible to beat up CS with your other characters to get limits? maybe tifa can crit him too, lolz
"Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence."
This thread should never be bumped to 6th...
We need everyone to share their own unique genius and enlighten us all. Find your inspiration and take to the skies...
"Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence."
This thread should never be bumped to 6th...
We need everyone to share their own unique genius and enlighten us all. Find your inspiration and take to the skies...
Do NOT bump a thread for the sake of bumping it.
Sage advice from a friend of Jim: So put your tinfoil hat back in the closet, open your eyes to the truth, and realize that the government is in fact causing austismal cancer with it's 9/11 fluoride vaccinations of your water supply.
This thread should never be bumped to 6th...
We need everyone to share their own unique genius and enlighten us all. Find your inspiration and take to the skies...
Do NOT bump a thread for the sake of bumping it.
correct, bump it to share their own unique genius and enlighten us all...
So how can 7777 fever be used? I'm thinking HP plus or something, I guess Tifa with 7777 would make sense at some point, then later it's going to be able all about getting CS limit breaks. Also does CS himself need to kill 40 enemies? And he also needs to use another limit 7 times, correct? A real challenge will be to find the compromise between going out of your way to get slots ASAP and working towards slots without going out of your way hardly at all; I'm sure the optimal solution will be some compromise between the two.
So how plausible is 7777 in this run?
Maybe there's some glitch to trick the game into thinking you have 7777, like with MP/HP switch and duping materia. I'm also remembering some significance to 1111, or am I'm confabulating?
"Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence."
You so just made that post up to keep this bumped!
Ok. In regards to 7777HP...10% health is what you get per materia at stage 1. No point focusing on the levels after that as any bosses used with this strat would be much later on in the game (post Mideel).
Let's say for arguments' sake the character you apply this to Cloud or Cid (IMO shouldn't be Tifa or Cait Sith) is approx. lvl. 19. by then. Say they have around 800hp. This is how far their HP could go...
800 > 880 > 968 > 1065 > 1172 > 1289 > 1418 > 1560 > 1716 (that's one weapon with max slots)
1716 > 1888 > 2077 > 2285 > 2514 > 2765 > 3042 > 3346 > 3681 (and an accessory at max slots!)
Just wouldn't work, mate. There's the factoring in of buying 16 of this materia and an additional inventory time even if you manipulated the exp and hp points per level well enough later on in the game. Slots and Death Sentence shenanigans it is!
You so just made that post up to keep this bumped!
Ok. In regards to 7777HP...10% health is what you get per materia at stage 1. No point focusing on the levels after that as any bosses used with this strat would be much later on in the game (post Mideel).
Let's say for arguments' sake the character you apply this to Cloud or Cid (IMO shouldn't be Tifa or Cait Sith) is approx. lvl. 19. by then. Say they have around 800hp. This is how far their HP could go...
800 > 880 > 968 > 1065 > 1172 > 1289 > 1418 > 1560 > 1716 (that's one weapon with max slots)
1716 > 1888 > 2077 > 2285 > 2514 > 2765 > 3042 > 3346 > 3681 (and an accessory at max slots!)
Just wouldn't work, mate. There's the factoring in of buying 16 of this materia and an additional inventory time even if you manipulated the exp and hp points per level well enough later on in the game. Slots and Death Sentence shenanigans it is!
I thought equipping materia reduced your max HP. Shows how long its been since I've played this game.
That rule applies to magic and summon materia only. Seeing as this will be a TAS speedrun antd or other contenders won't reach a level high enough where they will need magic or summon materia to reduce their stats. HP Plus is an independent materia type so HP Plus only adds health not depletes it.
