Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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RTA means real-time attack, it's not a TAS. If you mean 2 TASes, one aiming for real time and one for in-game time, Super Metroid is the only game where I remember them co-existing, but even then IGT was obsoleted by a run aiming for real time. You can pick whatever timing you prefer, just know that
Vault rules wrote:
Movies that aim for in-game time instead of real-time are only allowed for Vault if that goal makes game-play shorter. If optimizing for the in-game time makes actual game-play longer, such a movie is not eligible for Vault.
Also hard to tell about OoB without knowing the differences between 2 runs. What would the estimated times be for out-of-bounds and for in-bounds? How much direct content overlap will be in them?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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That was a pre-Moons obsoletion, and these days 1p and 2p co-exist fine in a lot of games.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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If the movie starts playing correctly and then desyncs later on, there's nothing we can do, it's just lack of proper savestate support for a given machine. Your best bet is figuring out which frames not to save on.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
If movie recording was started while paused, the replay dialog should also be opened while paused.
If the state was saved while paused, it should also be loaded while paused.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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Mechanics are quite annoying in this game, and the last level made them look especially bad, so I decided to do some more checking and saved 280 frames (compared to the trimmed version of this submission).
Link to videoUser movie #69320246506369467
Here's a primitive lua script that prints your X coordinate so you could actually check if you're improving.
Download PicaPau.lua
Language: lua
while true do
xpos = memory.read_s16_be(0x01c0, "68K RAM")
gui.text(0,100,"x: "..xpos)
emu.frameadvance()
end
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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And by "console input".
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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Jungon wrote:
Also I think the boat stage has a shortcut in a waterfall that wasn't used in this easy mode run
Can you elaborate on this?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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Overall it sounds like ASE can dramatically break gameplay and result in all sorts of events that may or may not be able to directly spoil the completion criteria. Most likely it won't be allowed, but to actually spark a rule discussion (since the technique is so new), your best bet is making an any% run that uses it.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Arbitrary code execution of ROM data, and memory corruption tricks to write to arbitrary memory are also not allowed.
Will gaining ASE involve writing to arbitrary memory?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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CasualPokePlayer wrote:
So asking in the event a Gen 2 Glitched Catch 'em All TAS ever happens, I'm just going to pose the question: would ASE (Arbitrary Script Execution) be allowed?
How do you achieve ASE?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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heysamesam wrote:
I would say a super optimized TAS NG following the current world record from RTA would be around 1h30m. I'm currently experimenting with strategy that utilizes TAS but not sure how far I can push sub 1:30 if possible even. Add around 45 minutes for the NG+ content and you're looking at around 3:40 ~ 4:00.
What was the estimate for "hacked/hard 100%" again?
heysamesam wrote:
If you want a list of NG+ content and why it can categorically be listed under hard mode to allow a "hard mode hack" entry I can do it. I'm still on the lookout for help to locate the hex address for the Rood Inverse to see if the game will behave weirdly if toggled on in a fresh save.
It will definitely be needed in submission text when it's done, but since we're discussing the fate of that submission in advance, it makes sense to have a list in advance too, and have people assess it.
Forgot if I asked but is there any kind of an in-game cheat code or a password to unlock NG+ right away?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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Thanks, fixed.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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I'm gonna need some feedback on this and the other movie (it will probably be similar for both of them).
I personally thought that the movement speed is very bad, but all the rest is great, just like it's said in the submission: amazing graphics and gameplay variety. None of the sections lasted enough to get me bored, so I'm voting Yes, on both movies since they share those qualities.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Link to video
I don't like this version because there's nothing going on while waiting. Maybe if the boll repeatedly tries to die and gets saved until the timer runs out, it'd look better.
The situation with Tetris and both other Pinball movies is that they don't take significant time to game over, and also the fact that all 3 of those movies have a full-blown ending. For games that have an ending, it makes perfect sense to game over if that's the only sensible way to trigger the ending.
For games that have no ending but have a scores screen, it also makes sense to game over to access it, but the more time it takes, the less enjoyable it gets, still depending on how entertaining the waiting time is of course. If there's nothing you can do while waiting and there's a lot of time to spend, in my opinion it feels worse than simply stopping the movie (and the encode) after you've completed the last required thing.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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What would be the potential duration of a movie that gets 100% starting from initial game start as it's designed? And of NG+ hack?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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Samsara wrote:
That is literally the problem. They don't need to be specific. Making them overly specific does nothing but introduce increasingly arbitrary restrictions that we end up gradually whittling down anyway once we realize that they contradict our other sets of overly specific rules. If all of our rules end up being very, very specific, then is there really any reason to have Judges at all apart from having us there to clarify those rules? The approach we take to submissions doesn't have to be strictly pragmatic and nothing else, we can be allowed some idealism here and there.
We need to try to appeal to the TAS community at large instead of trying to refine things to specifically fit the people that are already here. 12 pages of people arguing about Vault ended up with a system that still needs to be refined almost 10 years later, because it started off too specific for a tier that was inherently meant to be broad. This isn't saying "don't listen to our community", of course, just that we shouldn't be EXCLUSIVELY listening to them when it ends up unintentionally ostracizing potential new members.
I didn't say sophisticated or complex. They can be idealistic and abstract. But when we define them, we still need to appeal to the crowd that's already there, and if we want, to the people whom we hope to attract in the future. The main point of any rules we make is that they should not disappoint the audience (current and potential). So we will need to be very careful with the goals we set and with how we word things. That's where the rules need to be specific: in how well they grasp where we want to be as a community.
Samsara wrote:
This is the solution I was thinking of, actually. It sounds possible in theory and only requires a single change to the game for the desired result. Heck, for the true ROM hack experience, it could probably be hacked into the game itself without much effort so it wouldn't require a cheat at all. There's some info on DataCrystal for Vagrant Story, at least, so that'd be a good place to start.
If we define this ROM hack as a pure hard mode, made harder by discarding all the NG+ advantages while also unlocking all its challenges, that sounds like a worthy approach. So if someone makes a list of things we block to make our lives harder (gameplay wise), and things we unlock to make our lives even harder, with that patch, it'd be very helpful.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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Chanoyu wrote:
Would it be possible to judge the Vagrant Story case as a hard-mode rom-hack of sorts? That's basically the point of the idea as I understand it, and it might fit in some existing category seen that way, or at least the normal rules about difficulty choice would apply to it.
Hear me out here: What if there didn't have to be a common, universal ruleset? We're never going to be able to come up with one, likely not even one that works for 50%, 25%, or even 10% of all games, so what if we just encouraged the authors to work with us directly on these kinds of submissions with a much more basic set of guidelines (if any at all) as opposed to one that tries to handle every submission by itself?
The problem is not with inventing (or being unable to invent) universal rules. If we want our rules to look/feel/be legitimate, we want to come up with very, very specific rules that do not disappoint the staff and the audience. It took us 12 pages to add Vault. Since we're a community of people that try to go beyond human in a variety of directions, we have a lot of argument geeks that we should be able to convince.
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Samsara wrote:
We can work with the author to:
1. Define the goal of their run and verify that it would be a good fit for the site
2. Define the minimum amount of cheating necessary for that goal
3. Design reproduction steps to make it work for everyone
I really think the only universal guideline should be "Get it approved in advance", and then we can figure things out from there case-by-case. At most, I would add "Cheats that benefit the player cannot be used", but even then I feel like that's something that might not work in some cases.
I'm starting to feel like our "rules must be universal" mindset is much more of a problem than a solution to problem, but that's a different and much deeper discussion for a later date.
That almost sounds like relying on personal preferences of a judge team. Nothing wrong with that in an area that's designed to be subjective. And legitimacy is based on subjective feelings... it just requires approval from a very large group of people. Excitement sparks ideas, but to make it all actually happen we also need to put in hard mental work and be ready for it.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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The problem with cheats is arbitrariness. If cheats are needed for NG+ to look more like fresh completion, it proves that the game was never designed to work that way, and it doesn't have any oversights that could make it possible through glitching. Since there's infinite variation of possible cheats for any given game, we enter a whole different universe of play, and we're meant to be able to design rules for this chaotic infinity. We'd have to rely on something common because that's what makes a movie impressive. But I don't know about any common way of cheating in the speedrunning scene, where it would also make the outcome more impressive than without cheats.
I made cheated runs a part of my Demo tier proposal, but despite of havingdiscussed itfor adecade, we haven't ever agreed on the rules for such an ambiguous category.
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andypanther wrote:
The cutscene will play and fade into the last race result screen.
This sounds like the best option, because it's the last thing you can show after having completed everything, before going back to track selection again. Using a reset to skip the credits is fine because it makes your full completion movie optimal.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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heysamesam wrote:
I illegitimately jump to the final boss and defeat it.
We don't allow that. If it's a verification movie before NG+, it's meant to show that you got to that point in a valid way without cheating. If you got there by cheating, then the entire NG+ run that goes next is spoiled by the impossibility of gameplay that it will contain.
Overall I'm still not sure what your primary goal is with your movie, because you want it to mix up several different concepts. It can't be full completion if it skips initial completion of the game (it's not full if there's only a half). And it can't be NG+ because it builds on an illegitimate foundation.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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Unlocking all unlockables and playing through them (if they have speedrunnable gameplay) sounds like a solid goal IMO. If it's too complicated to describe with a label we can just call it "100%".
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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I admit I don't quite get what's happening in TTYD even with commentary, and even though I liked the video about history of TTYD speedrunning. I don't understand RPGs. But we have a few of them starred, so this one looks like a worthy addition judging by how people feel about this movie, and yes it is super glitched. And completely different from Sunshine, which is a game with a unique mechanic and intense 3D platforming that's built around it.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
