Posts for feos

1 2 130 131 132 439 440
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
I think the rule I mentioned after that post resolved quite a few of your concerns. Look at it this way: There is a feature to unlock a new monster not present from the start. The game does not tell you what you need to use exactly for some known outcome. It encourages you to experiment. Yet without unlocking anything, you can still complete the game. The site rules do not care what this feature is technically, as long as it functionally does the above. It might have been a password generator that would pseudo-randomly spawn you new monsters, with the game asking to test words of the English language against it. It might have been a button combination used as a randomness seed. It might have bean leftover RAM that remains from previously used game, and isn't initialized by the game in question. The options are endless, the functionality is the same: external data not known from normal gameplay is used to unlock new monsters. If instead it was something required to even complete the game, we'd have to make an exception yet again, even if unlocking is the only way to complete it. But thankfully, this isn't the case, and I honestly don't know if it will ever be. As for optimality, as long as the image suits one's goals, it doesn't have to be unimprovable in that regard. It should only be hard to improve, which means due effort should be invested into optimizing it. But human nature means there will always be room for further improvements.
Omnigamer wrote:
Finally, I just want to say that if the criteria listed at the end of feos' longpost are taken up as official policy, then it is unlikely any disc-based Monster Rancher game will ever be acceptable on the site. The game, while interesting to optimize, does not allow enough expressive freedom or content diversity to meet Moon entertainment requirements. If that's the way that it has to be, then so be it, but it effectively kills off an otherwise reasonable game choice from competitive consideration.
Do you mean obtaining monsters from external discs is required to complete the game after all? If not, avoiding external images is vaultable.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
Tested a couple dumping options. Requirements: fast encoding, fast seeking, small filesize. Tested on a toaster, Sonic 3 & Knuckles running for 10k frames without input. Lagarith Command: Video for Windows (2GB split unavoidable, also codec is Windows only) Keyint: 1 (can't be changed) Seeking backwards: instant. Size: 256MB (100%) Speed: 140fps (100%) libx264rgb Command: ffmpeg -c:a pcm_s16le -c:v libx264rgb -qp 0 -preset ultrafast -g 1 -pix_fmt rgb24 -f avi Keyint: 1 Seeking backwards: instant. Size: 911MB (356%) Speed: 130fps (93%) Command: ffmpeg -c:a pcm_s16le -c:v libx264rgb -qp 0 -preset ultrafast -g 30 -pix_fmt rgb24 -f avi Keyint: 30 Seeking backwards: instant. Size: 177MB (69%) Speed: 130fps (93%) Command: ffmpeg -c:a pcm_s16le -c:v libx264rgb -qp 0 -preset ultrafast -g 60 -pix_fmt rgb24 -f avi Keyint: 60 Seeking backwards: fast. Size: 163MB (63%) Speed: 130fps (93%) Command: ffmpeg -c:a pcm_s16le -c:v libx264rgb -qp 0 -preset ultrafast -pix_fmt rgb24 -f avi Keyint: 250 (default) Seeking backwards: slow! Size: 153MB (59%) Speed: 130fps (93%) Command: ffmpeg -c:a pcm_s16le -c:v libx264rgb -qp 0 -preset ultrafast -g 600 -pix_fmt rgb24 -f avi Keyint: 600 Seeking backwards: really slow! Size: 151MB (58%) Speed: 130fps (93%) FFV1 Command (what Dolphin uses): ffmpeg -c:a pcm_s16le -c:v ffv1 -pix_fmt bgr0 -level 1 -g 1 -coder 1 -context 1 -f avi Keyint: 1 Seeking backwards: instant. Size: 331MB (129%) Speed: 80fps (57%) Command: ffmpeg -c:a pcm_s16le -c:v ffv1 -pix_fmt bgr0 -level 1 -g 30 -coder 1 -context 1 -f avi Keyint: 30 Seeking backwards: instant. Size: 308MB (120%) Speed: 80fps (57%)
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
DrD2k9 wrote:
Putting a different CD into the PSX is not relying on knowledge external to the game, just data external to the game.
Data is information, knowledge is acknowledged information, any knowledge is data. If you insert an image external to the game, you get the knowledge that you haven't got from the actual game. This knowledge is already contained in a potential form in this external image. You game did not have it either. It will learn this external knowledge if you insert such an image. So yes, putting a different CD is relying on external knowledge.
DrD2k9 wrote:
A player who inputs a code must know the specific code before inputting it to yield it's result (and it can be generally assumed that the player knows what that result will be before using the code). A player sticking a different CD into the PSX doesn't have to have a specific CD nor does the player need to know the result of the CD used to continue with the game.
They still have to have a CD to insert. They may not have one.
DrD2k9 wrote:
Further, the use of the CD is intended as part of normal play, not play enhanced/altered by a secret code/input sequence.
First, the very "normal" is moot for this game. We're having this argument exactly because it's moot. Second, you spawn secret monsters using this method, you unlock secret content, and this is covered by the rules as unvaultable.
DrD2k9 wrote:
I generally look at codes/passwords/etc. as things that either intentionally make the game easier/harder. The CD swap with the MR games is not a guaranteed result of easier or harder (it could in fact yield a neutral result).
Obviously obtaining a more advanced monster makes it easier, compared to sating from scratch. The fact that someone at some point in history figured out how the game uses the other CD's data (which then allows us to pre-define that CD) doesn't change the fact that the game is still using the information as if it's a normal unenhanced playthrough. The CD swap is a 'luck' situation. Getting the best possible monster from the swap is like getting lucky in picking the right disc when playing on actual hardware. We just manipulate the luck to yield the best outcome.[/quote]
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
Movie Rules wrote:
We allow playing unlockable content using in-game passwords Using in-game codes[1] or passwords at the start of a game is allowed if it makes the game harder or if it makes cosmetic changes to the game, as long as parts of the game are not skipped. Using in-game codes or passwords at the start of a game to unlock a special game mode, character, level sets, or otherwise play the game in some unusual way is allowed. However movies of this nature are not considered to be one of the primary branches for the game.
This is indeed the key to this whole conversation. See the explanation of what tasvideos means by in-game codes:
When we speak about codes that are part of a game that we allow for use in certain scenarios, we are talking about passwords that can be entered in a menu, pressing some buttons on the title screen, passing execution parameters or setting environment variables for DOS games, or anything of a similar nature. This excludes things like Game Genie codes or emulator cheating tools.
It is very clear that for Monstar Rancher 2, a feature that allows you to unlock hidden monsters is exactly of this nature as well, so it falls under all the limitations as these codes do.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
DrD2k9 wrote:
Required, No.
Then it's not any%. My point all along is that you can't disagree that those external CDs are still not parts of the actual software we're playing. Launching the game does not magically spawn CDs in your room. It's theoretically possible to program generating an extra image, if CD recording is a thing when the game is being released, but it is still fundamentally separate from the game we're playing. If you play Super Metroid, you make decisions on which items you want to pick, and they fundamentally belong to the game. You are able to access them after simply launching it and playing through a bit. They are valid for any%. Damn, even SRAM usage itself is allowed, as long as you generate SRAM by playing through the game you've launched from scratch. You start the game with clear SRAM, you write to it at some point - you can load it. And it's still any%. But when you use SRAM that was obtained outside of your main movie, for example, it comes from a movie that you've stopped an hour ago, then it's not any%. You need to understand the principle here: starting a new movie from SRAM is intended and encouraged. But it's not vaultable, because this SRAM is external to your movie. The thing with external CDs is identical: they can not be a part of your movie, therefore they aren't vaultable.
DrD2k9 wrote:
It's kind of like Generation 1 pokemon games. Through normal gameplay (not using glitches) it's impossible to catch all the pokemon without trading with another player via a link cable attached to another gameboy (an outside source of data). Doing so isn't necessary to beat the game, but it can be used as a resource to yield different/stronger pokemon that may allow for beating the game faster than playing through without trading. (yes I realize the presence of glitches makes this moot for pokemon games specifically, but the concept of the outside resource is sound.)
You said it yourself. Catching them all is not any% for pokemon games, it's full completion.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
But are external CDs required to be able to beat the game?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
I have a more concrete point. If magically obtaining a monster from an external source is any% for this game, then what are we supposed to do with all the gameplay where you have to raise/train/improve/breed your monster? What is it even there for? Is it not any% anymore? Is it primary any% versus secondary any%?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
Do you think a lot of people would agree with you on this?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
The question is, do you count the scenario where things you haven't obtained during normal gameplay, magically appear from the outside, as an any% category?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
My build is just a hack of X432R.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
Saved game is not related either. Saved game won't help us get rid of the additional image requirement if we want new monsters. The question is, why do you think we should judge 2 similar scenarios differently: 1) using SRAM to unlock new content not available from scratch, and 2) using additional image to unlock new content not available from scratch? How does the latter magically make it any%? Especially given how strict some people are about any% in general, the purpose of Vault is to never have to explain anyone that "well, this particular not-quite-any% is still considered any% by some people, therefore we consider it absolutely objectively clear cut, and therefore vaultable". Do excuses like this really sound sensible to anyone?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
Using SRAM in games like Pokemon or Chrono Trigger is also expected and encouraged. Doesn't mean it should become vaultable. And it's unvaultable not because of things you're describing ("unintended external source (such as a game-genie)"), but because it's not running the game from scratch: it's not any%.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
DrD2k9 wrote:
As far as self-created images: Assuming someone knew exactly where the game looked for data on the target image/disc, couldn't someone create a image to yield the desired data then burn it to a practical CD and use it on a real system?
Of course!
DrD2k9 wrote:
If that's the case, then any CD data or image that could be burned to real media should be considered valid as it would be theoretically usable on a real machine as well. I agree and fully support MESHUGGAH's reasons for restricting the data of that image for publication on the site. From a data standpoint though, the examples suggested -- (nudes, virus, justin beiber albums) -- would still probably be valid data sources.
I don't understand what you're saying. What's your take on my longpost?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
Images that ultimately belong to the real world, and not to the game program, can't be used for movies, simply because you can not record real world into a movie just like that. The real world uses to decay, and images may disappear over time, becoming unavailable. But I already elaborated on the practical benefits of a hand-crafter image here: http://tasvideos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=473807#473807 As Memory pointed out, using such an image in the movie, with detailed instructions how to recreate it, makes it future proof in addition to all else.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
Right, for anything like this we'll need to come up with new rules, that'd consider all the limitations and possibilities we could bring up. It's just completely separate from the additional images problem, so it shouldn't affect our decisions for this game and similar ones.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
So far I don't know any other game (or game series) that'd explicitly ask for irrelevant images. Within this exceptional case, validity and reproducibility should indeed be tested. But for all the other games, I believe the rule about image integrity will stand.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
ThunderAxe31 wrote:
There is no such thing as optimal outcome anyway. We had a lot of movies in the past that looked unbeatable, and despite that they got bested at some point, again and again. The only thing we can do is assess if a movie looks reasonably optimized for our standards.
No, you can very well craft an image that suits best your needs for a given movie. You want to maximize some stats and minimize some side effect - you use the image that actually maximizes and minimizes those. I don't mean that it has to lead to an unbeatable movie, it should just provide you with the best seed you want. It's just easier to design such an image yourself that to look through hundreds of games hoping some will appear as useful.
ThunderAxe31 wrote:
I suppose you're referring to the optimality and legality problems. For what concernes optimality: designing an image by hand requires reverse-engeneering of the game code, and I don't think that we should require the TASers to work to such extent for making an acceptable TAS. There are some games that provide an insane amount of possible routes, making it pratically impossible to know beforehand how much a movie is close (or far) to perfection. Even if we struggled to design a seemingly perfect image by hand, it could still be beaten by using a game image. For what concerns legality, I already said that there shouldn't be problems if the image used is a PSX game as well. What's wrong with my point?
Do you really think blindly trying every game is more effective than tweaking a single image? And if no game results in something we want, what do we do? Give up and use a game that gives us stats known to be suboptimal? I don't see a point in this approach. As for reverse engineering, all we need to know is what is used and how, and what we can afford as a result. All the planning is done independently regardless. And then, to accommodate us with our route, we design an image that works best for us. Then, I think limiting ourselves to PSX games (or games in general) here is arbitrary. This game explicitly asks to try all sorts of irrelevant images, so if we stick to something particular, we disregard the game instruction. And if we don't stick to games, then we start depending on things that don't even belong to TASing or gaming, so it's even worse. So to escape from this loophole, I suggest using something we have full control on, just because it's the most effective approach.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
What do you mean?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
What if no game gives optimal outcome here? Having to brute-force this problem by trying them all doesn't feel like anything we want to approve. When we design the perfect image by hand, it removes all the possible problems in my eyes.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
zoboner, please try latest gliden64 on some newer n64 emulator that can show all the options gliden64 has. m64py would do. If you can find some options not present in bizhawk that fix your problems with gliden64, we can add them to bizhawk so it works there.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
Adding RGB lossless encode doesn't mean we remove other ones. But another thing that needs to be tested is vp9. And it has a lossless mode as well.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
We can have a gif with several screenshots that can be seen on mouse hover. If there are more highlights, everyone is free to suggest.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
Timestamp?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player (1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11287
Location: RU
The situation in general We TAS software, which is games, in isolation. We heavily depend on absence of external modifications to that software, and we guarantee they're not applied. This is important for the validity reasons. Which, in turn, is important when we want to keep TASing impressive, entertaining, legitimate in terms of competition, available to everyone due to equality of initial conditions. We allow any input the software in question allows us to send to it. We don't care whether this input is actually processed, accounted for, causes bugs, or just subtly changes the game state. This is why we allow contradictory directions on the D-pad, Reset while saving, using input bits that aren't present on the official controller, and so on and so forth. We do not allow events of the physical or hardware world to be used in TASes. Because these can't be emulated. You can not emulate effects of kicking the console, pulling the cartridge out half-way, room temperature affecting startup state, random bit decay, etc. Emulation means we reproduce the logic of the software. Simulation means we try to reproduce a physical event we can't fully understand nor recreate. Game image is written on a read-only medium, and is stored by the physical representation of bits on it, but we don't care about their physical nature: the bits only contain the information in a machine readable form, but the very logic (program) behind this information can be encoded in any way we want. So we copy this program on our hard drives and use it for TASing. We basically decode the information contained on the game medium, and disregard the physical side of things. The rules The rule about game integrity that I added recently reflects all of the above. We only TAS game programs, and we want only game programs to be TASed. Swapping disks in unintended order breaks the integrity if the original program. The program was designed as a whole, and then broken into disks so it could fit. It's not like it's represented as separate independent chapters that we play in the order we're asked to play them. The game explicitly needs the next disk, because it's written to be consecutive - integral. Adding disks that aren't required consecutive parts of the original game program has the same problematic aspects, so it's also not allowed. In this case one is not TASing the original game at all anymore, and irrelevant data is being fed to the console, so this may count as modifying the game image, which is fundamentally banned. Additionally, the above scenarios also make a breach in the software world we're dealing with, and introduce physical and hardware events. Those events can't be emulated, as I said, aren't reproducible or deterministic, so we can't afford introducing them into your system. After all, in our emulators we even patch away actual non-determinism of the console, because we prefer verifiability of movies and sync stability of savestates. Not that inserting irrelevant images can't be emulated, but it's a step out of our game-software-in-isolation environment. Since we depend on this isolation's integrity, any breach in it causes all sorts of problems, like legitimacy issues in the eyes of the community, undefined initial conditions for the competition, undefined borderline between emulation and simulation, undefined reliability and stability of emulation, and likely some others. Exceptions? This is a tough problem. Given all of the above, this particular game is known to have content that can only be unlocked if irrelevant images that don't belong to the game are used. Trying to work around this would require starting from an emulator savestate, as even save file can't carry or generate all the needed info we need here. So first of all, I think we need an exception in this case. Since it is so unique and ridiculous, I'm not even sure if we need to allow exceptions like this right in the rules. Maybe some smart way of addressing this can be added, but I can't generalize it yet. I believe that using arbitrary images even for cases like this one should not be allowed under any circumstances. Arbitrary means literally arbitrary: it can be an unreleased Demo disk of some Gore Grind band from Antarctica, and the movie may completely refuse to sync on anything else. Allowing arbitrary images means we invite such scenarios for all such cases. We can't limit this to "obtainable" disks either, because this definition is even weaker, and introduces actual legal problems. I believe that for this game, we must limit ourselves to the most effective hand-crafted image that does what the game wants from it, and nothing more. This removes the problems mentioned in the previous paragraph and allows to stick to something strongly and clearly defined, while also guaranteeing against any legality problems. Vaultable? Should we allow movies using images, that don't belong to the original game, for Vault? The Vault is designed to only allow things that can be easily, clearly, and unambiguously defined. While some of the Vault rues are still quite complicated in their wording (like those for sports games, or for full completion), the spirit behind them is still simple: we want clear cuts and meaningful speed competition records. In that sense, due to all the complexity of this case-by-case exception, I do not think that we should allow use of unintended images for Vault. And the definition of intended image is the same: either the game explicitly asks for some particular image, or the publisher encourages using it, like it happens with Sonic & Knuckles and Sonic 3 (or modern DLCs maybe). Added later: Another way to look at this, it's similar to save anchored movies. Starting a game as it is and playing it from scratch is a vaultable concept. Using an external resource to boost your stats is not. This submission If we agree on all of the above, this submission would need to be 1) replayed using the hand-crafted, most optimal secondary disk image, 2) optimal enough to be accepted, 3) entertaining enough to be accepted to Moons. If either of these isn't met, it'd have to be rejected. Opinions?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
1 2 130 131 132 439 440