Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
DrD2k9 wrote:
I mostly agree with this. There's no reason to have 10 different people with Playground runs of the same category doing roughly the same thing. I'd rather see the Playground be more a variety of unique content for a given game than soething that ammounts to little more than a congested leaderboard of similar runs having slightly different times.
So should we reject previous, beaten runs from PG when new ones appear?
DrD2k9 wrote:
However, if two runs that would otherwise be in the same niche category for a game manage to achieve that goal using significantly differing methods (or the slower of the two contains an interesting techinique that isn't seen in other runs in the Playground), it may be wise to keep both runs in order to archive the differing/interesting techniques.
That sounds non-trivial to resolve in practice. Comparing every new run to every old run in that category looking for differences, is going to get exhausting very quickly.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
Thoughts about optimality.
If submissions that fail to beat a published movie are just sent to playground, there's zero incentive to make better movies, and it can be flooded with low effort stuff that's basically the same. Even tho I don't see the need for obsoletion in playground, I think we should only send there movies that are better than whatever already exists in playground. If it's slower than that or a published movie of the same goal, it doesn't allow us to showcase any niche goals better, and it's better to just reject.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
I got the movie to sync without doing anything specific.
rythin, please put sync info in the submission description:
https://tasvideos.org/EmulatorResources/LibTAS#DocumentSyncRequirements
It used to be required to be right inside .ltm, but after some reevaluation we decided it should not be required to be in the annotations at all times.
EDIT:
I still get no audio in the encode even though I dumped on latest interim...--audio-driver ALSA is indeed required for proper audio dumping (makes it properly mute in libtas too).
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
MrTASer wrote:
Is there any way to record NDS touch screen while TAS Studio running.
Is there any method to do so with TAS Studio?
I tried touch X and touch Y but it didnt showed anything on the roll.
Whats the alternative?
Double-click analog cell then use mouse drag or numeric keys (or arrows) to enter input.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
Try just waiting longer.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
Desyncs in the same place for me. I want to suggest also enabling "Runtime -> Busy loop detection". It may make dumping and software renderer unnecessary for replay but feel free to have both enabled. Also what resolution are you using for the resync? 1280x720?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
adelikat brought up a very important problem with hacks. There's no guarantee against patch files containing copyrighted material, so we can't host them on tasvideos. And if the hack is so damn obscure that it only exists in a single place and even that place is a patched ROM already, not a patch file, there are potential legal problems in supporting such hacks, or problems with ability to replay them if the link goes down.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
CoolKirby wrote:
I thought we only created new Games on first publication of a game, at least since c. 2012 when every submission was given a Game (which is most of why we still have Games like this with no published runs). Do we want to elevate Playground area Games to the same status as published Games? Like you said, it would facilitate game-based navigation. But should we worry about a large number of ROMhacks for e.g. SMB clogging up the Game list (or at least the NES list)?
Actually, what is the current consensus on what to do with Game pages with only submissions, userfiles, or a Game Resources page but no publications?
Game based navigation will only be fully usable if we collect whatever we have for a given game on its page. If it's just a userfile, it makes sense to link it for posterity, so other people could easily find it in the same hub with all other games.
"Too many games" is easily solved if we have a bunch of nested tabs (or some other equally handy UI): Company -> Device -> Letter -> Games for that letter.
SRC's game based navigation is unusable because you have to infinitely hit "load more" to actually see all the games for the platform and find your game there. The only usable option there is search. We want both approaches to be easy to use. If we finally get expandable spoilers, we can just hide hacks for some game and show them on demand.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
We link to the list of submissions on game pages. If it's organized to sort by branch and by time (or date), it will be easy to see it as speedrun history, some kind of a leaderboard too.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
I've been running it for 6 hours straight with all the tweaks I could think of. Never got this clip to work
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
Natetheman223 wrote:
Fortamn wrote:
Of course, either of these only seems justifiable in extreme cases. Even the "10 hours" argument seems reasonable only because this is a game emulated by Dolphin, which isn't quite the most sync friendly. If it is some game from older platforms without much emulation syncing issue, the number of hours of required gameplay in a verification movie would need to be much higher for practices like this to be justifiable IMO.
What's the harm in allowing it? If it does get abused and an effect slips into the real movie despite cheats being disabled, either A.) no one cares enough to test it or B.) someone does care enough, gives their proof, and the movie is disqualified. Or maybe it should be required to test for any verification movie that uses external cheats (but that's just more work for the judges, oops).
This is a borderline between "nobody cares enough to prove it's legit" and "nobody cares enough to prove it's not legit". The latter is post-moderation, it's when we want content to be presented "as is", without our dictatorship (basically speedrun.com). The former is when we want it to have our dictatorial seal of approval (basically speeddemosarchive.com). Seal of approval means "we verified and yes this movie is legit". We can't really say that if nobody in the world had the time to do the real verification. And I don't think we should be just mixing both concepts together without a clear distinction.
So in addition to emulating SDA with publications, we also want to emulate SRC with the Playground. That way we can keep high quality but entirely subjective stuff in one place, and high quality but more objective stuff in another.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
Bobo the King wrote:
So my simple feelings toward the (since resolved) question at hand are that archive.org is a great alternative to YouTube in the absence of torrents, but should archive.org go belly-up for whatever reason, expect me to come back here and pound on the table, demanding that we reintegrate torrents.
Did you miss the part where nobody is interested in seeding those torrents anymore? We can't demand publishers to keep all their encodes forever just to seed them, because they would be probably never pulled that way from them until Archive dies, exactly because YT is much easier.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
I'll try it within a week.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
Fortranm wrote:
Labeling the any% as something else seems to be a common practice for 2DMariogamesingeneral for some reason.
Because it's a fundamental, objective in-game mechanic that affects gameplay so much that it can define the whole branch. Same as "2 players".
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
Radiant wrote:
But feos, that's precisely my point: should hacks be allowed in the playground if "the hack and the run are great", or should ALL hacks be allowed in the playground?
I do not think the site has been too strict in 2020-2021 about which romhacks were allowed.
I said it should just be properly published, to Moons, if the hack and the run are great. There's no need to keep those in Playground.
I personally don't see a big problem in allowing all hacks to Playground as long as the movie is good, but I also think we should just let the game community decide which hacks to allow, because it will be subjective anyway if there is a borderline, so let's rely on subjectivity of people who care.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
Let's get back to SM64 shall we? I started thinking about how we would branch them so 16-star route makes the most sense, and I found myself wondering why we even mention stars in branches that don't aim to maximize them.
https://tasvideos.org/Games/PublicationHistory/246
"All 120 stars" is clear in that its goal is getting all stars, and the number is iconic.
What about "70 stars, no BLJ"? Can you get less stars without BLJ?
What about "1/0 star" and "1 key"? It looks like the amount of stars and keys obtained is just a consequence of whatever route appears to be the absolute fastest. It would probably make sense to spell out the collected stars/keys if we had those as separate branches, or if it was an in-game option to collect exactly that many. But here... it looks like it's just baseline branch?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
Radiant wrote:
Well, suppose I'm interested in NES Legend of Zelda; then it's likely I'm also interested in good romhacks of TLOZ. I'd expect good romhacks to be visible or linked from the TLOZ main page (or maybe from a "category:TLOZ" superpage), but this doesn't work if there's a ton of bad romhacks also linked.
For example, it's already the case that if I search the site for "Super Mario", the result is a list of ten romhacks but none of the SMB/SMW games are listed. So I'd say it's a valid concern that realistically, allowing any and all romhacks in playground will make it hard for people to find what they're actually looking for.
Good rom hacks should just get properly published imo. If we're too strict, we should be less strict as long as the hack and the run are great.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Fixed. The new site tells exactly where the error is, I love it!
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
Radiant wrote:
I don't want the playground to become unusable because of a flood of runs on poor quality romhacks, and so I believe that "no romhacks except in moons/stars" is a hard rule worth sticking to.
It's meant to be a part of game based navigation. Why would it become unusable? We'd just link hacks of a game as separate game pages.
DrD2k9 wrote:
I guess i just misunderstood how things would be curated in the Playground. If anyone can set a submission status to be a Playground run, how is the list curated?
Without some means of "rejecting" or removing runs that shouldn't be present, the list has no effective limits.
Post-moderation, like on speedrun.com. TASers of a game could get some kind of "game mod" priv so they could reject a submission from playground if it breaks playground rules. Judges too obviously.
CoolHandMike wrote:
As in how would I submit this? Instead of "Submit a Movie" would that maybe be split to a "Submit for Publication" and a "Submit to Playground" button? Then essentially the same flow as a normal submission?
2 buttons would probably be ideal. If you submit for pub, it's judged as usual, and can be sent to playground if it breaks regular movie rules but not playground rules. If you submit to playground, it's post-moderated.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
DrD2k9 wrote:
I feel we need to consider the concept of unpublication in regards to the Playground.
Currently, we don't unpublish any currently published runs. Instead we try (or hope) to obsolete them with a new run that corrects the reason that a run was erroneously published to begin with.
Should we consider having the ability to outright unpublish/delete runs from the Playground if a situation arises where something shouldn't have been allowed in there to begin with? If so, would this be part of the community curation our would it need to be main site staff?
Hopefully there's never a situation where something would need removed, but it's worth considering--just in case.
Did you read the OP? Playground is not a publication class, it's a submission status.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
Memory wrote:
A better way to handle it altogether would be to group identical releases of a game together when we switch to game based navigation.
This would solve my issues without introducing new problems.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
Radiant wrote:
feos wrote:
[*]Must break some Wiki: MovieRules (otherwise it just gets published)
This is a tricky one. Is it valid for the Playground to use a non-approved emulator, or a bad dump of a ROM, or any arbitrary ROMhack? What about Chess runs? Heck, what about submitting a movie on someone else's behalv (with proper accreditation) but without permission of the author?
As I mentioned above, we want authorship to be managed properly so nobody if affected in a bad way. About the rest, I don't see why not.
Radiant wrote:
Since "must reproduce" and "must have a goal" and "do not plagiarize" are also Movie Rules, it seems to me that Playground needs a division between "hard movie rules" that you cannot break, and "soft movie rules" that can be broken for the playground.
This is about wording. We'd say "here's a list of hard rules, but other movie rules can be broken in this section of the site".
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
run on a modified version of Dolphin Lua Core + TASStudio, with no specific emulator settings. The modified version of the Dolphin I use is required to run the DTM file without breaking the TAS file. You can download here: https://www.dropbox.com/home?preview=N100F+Hundo+TAS+Files.zip (Please DM me email address to access download)
I don't agree with these sync requirements. We don't want to rely on casual patches to Dolphin that we don't even know what code they change and how, because they may disappear after a while and the run would be impossible to sync (and we can't verify legitimacy of the patch itself). Dolphin Lua Core seems popular and reliable enough, so if they merged this patch I'd have no issue with accepting a movie that relies on it (provided it meets Wiki: MovieRules).
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Site Admin, Skilled player
(1238)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11302
Location: RU
So no description of what it changes (and why) either?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
The flagpole in the water level is in a different place.
The -2 level ends differently.
The -3 level is different.
There's no link to a patch.
There's no explanation how exactly to get the same results, only a mention of "a level editor".
This submission is not reproducible so far.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
